Post by emberobin on Jul 6, 2014 4:12:50 GMT
Let’s define some terms for the sake of making some progress in debating with anarcho-capitalists:
When a libertarian socialist (AKA social anarchist) says ‘private property’, we mean private ownership by individuals or a collective (such as a body of shareholders) of the means of production (i.e. areas of land larger than can be personally used by the ‘owner’, factory equipment that is not directly used by its owner/s, etc.). Private property does not include your computer, your house, your toothbrush, and other personal amenities.
When an ancap says ‘private property’, they mean anything that people (as individuals or as a collective) have bought, been gifted or created with their own hands by mixing their labour with natural resources. This does include property like large areas of land which can be rented out or factory equipment.
I propose that social anarchists, when discussing the concept of ‘private property’, as we understand the term, with ancaps instead use the term ‘bourgeois private property’ or ‘exploitative property’ to distinguish between our conception of private property and theirs, thereby preventing miscommunication.
When a social anarchist says ‘personal property’, we mean personal amenities that we have bought, been gifted or created with our own hands by mixing our labour with natural resources.
When an ancap says ‘personal property’, they are using the term interchangeably with ‘private property’ as they define it.
When a social anarchist says ‘anarchism’, we mean libertarian socialism. If you don’t know what libertarian socialism is, please at least read the Wikipedia article before engaging social anarchists in debate.
When an ancap says ‘anarchism’, they refer to a political philosophy advocating voluntary interaction in the absence of the State. Social anarchists advocate this too, but in our view, anarchism is much more than that.
Therefore, when a social anarchist says to an ancap, You are not an anarchist, what we mean is, You are not a libertarian socialist. You probably have not familiarised yourself with the ideas of Proudhon, Bakunin, Kropotkin and other classical anarchists. When an ancap calls themselves an ‘anarchist’, they mean they reject the state as well as initiation of violence. This can be frustrating to social anarchists, who reject capitalism and tend to see ancaps as attempting to appropriate our political identity whilst advocating for capitalism.
When a social anarchist says ‘capitalism’, we mean the institution of bourgeois private property.
When an ancap says ‘capitalism’, they mean voluntary exchange of property (including labour). Social anarchists are not opposed to voluntary exchange.
When a social anarchist says ‘socialism’, we mean rejection of the institution of bourgeois private property in favour of worker self-management (no hierarchy within the workplace) and ownership of the means of production.
When an ancap says ‘socialism’, they mean ‘a system in which the government owns and controls the means of production (supposedly for “the good of the people,” but in actual practice, for the good of the politicians).’*
When a social anarchist says ‘communism’, we mean a stateless, classless, moneyless system, wherein the means of production are owned collectively by a community of voluntarily associating individuals. This is a form of socialism. Everyone works according to their ability and shares according to need.
When an ancap says ‘communism’, they mean state ownership of everything. They often use this term interchangeably with ‘socialism’.
If there are any other terms you would like to see clarified, please let me know, and I will do my best to oblige.
* The Market for Liberty
When a libertarian socialist (AKA social anarchist) says ‘private property’, we mean private ownership by individuals or a collective (such as a body of shareholders) of the means of production (i.e. areas of land larger than can be personally used by the ‘owner’, factory equipment that is not directly used by its owner/s, etc.). Private property does not include your computer, your house, your toothbrush, and other personal amenities.
When an ancap says ‘private property’, they mean anything that people (as individuals or as a collective) have bought, been gifted or created with their own hands by mixing their labour with natural resources. This does include property like large areas of land which can be rented out or factory equipment.
I propose that social anarchists, when discussing the concept of ‘private property’, as we understand the term, with ancaps instead use the term ‘bourgeois private property’ or ‘exploitative property’ to distinguish between our conception of private property and theirs, thereby preventing miscommunication.
When a social anarchist says ‘personal property’, we mean personal amenities that we have bought, been gifted or created with our own hands by mixing our labour with natural resources.
When an ancap says ‘personal property’, they are using the term interchangeably with ‘private property’ as they define it.
When a social anarchist says ‘anarchism’, we mean libertarian socialism. If you don’t know what libertarian socialism is, please at least read the Wikipedia article before engaging social anarchists in debate.
When an ancap says ‘anarchism’, they refer to a political philosophy advocating voluntary interaction in the absence of the State. Social anarchists advocate this too, but in our view, anarchism is much more than that.
Therefore, when a social anarchist says to an ancap, You are not an anarchist, what we mean is, You are not a libertarian socialist. You probably have not familiarised yourself with the ideas of Proudhon, Bakunin, Kropotkin and other classical anarchists. When an ancap calls themselves an ‘anarchist’, they mean they reject the state as well as initiation of violence. This can be frustrating to social anarchists, who reject capitalism and tend to see ancaps as attempting to appropriate our political identity whilst advocating for capitalism.
When a social anarchist says ‘capitalism’, we mean the institution of bourgeois private property.
When an ancap says ‘capitalism’, they mean voluntary exchange of property (including labour). Social anarchists are not opposed to voluntary exchange.
When a social anarchist says ‘socialism’, we mean rejection of the institution of bourgeois private property in favour of worker self-management (no hierarchy within the workplace) and ownership of the means of production.
When an ancap says ‘socialism’, they mean ‘a system in which the government owns and controls the means of production (supposedly for “the good of the people,” but in actual practice, for the good of the politicians).’*
When a social anarchist says ‘communism’, we mean a stateless, classless, moneyless system, wherein the means of production are owned collectively by a community of voluntarily associating individuals. This is a form of socialism. Everyone works according to their ability and shares according to need.
When an ancap says ‘communism’, they mean state ownership of everything. They often use this term interchangeably with ‘socialism’.
If there are any other terms you would like to see clarified, please let me know, and I will do my best to oblige.
* The Market for Liberty
